"Blazing Trails and Breaking Norms: African American Women's Legacy in the Fire Service.

[00:00:00] Karen: welcome to the podcast African American Women in Fire Service, proudly presented by the African [00:00:15] American Firefighter Museum located at 1401 Central Avenue in the city of Los Angeles, California. I'm your host. Karen Slider and we are thrilled to bring you inspiring [00:00:30] interviews with various black women making significant contributions to fire service.
[00:00:37] Today we have the honor of speaking with Delisa Davies, a true trailblazer. [00:00:45] She holds the distinction of being the first African-American female firefighter to complete probation and become a full-time firefighter with the Los Angeles City Fire Department. [00:01:00] Delisa will be sharing her incredible journey with us, joining us via telephone.
[00:01:06] Miss Delisa Davies . Delisa Davies, are you there?
[00:01:11] Yes, I am. Welcome to the podcast [00:01:15] African American Women in Fire Service, proudly presented by the African American Firefighter Museum located at 1401 Central Avenue in the city of Los Angeles, California. [00:01:30] I'm your host. Karen Slider and we are thrilled to bring you inspiring interviews with various black women making significant contributions to fire service.
[00:01:43] Hi.
[00:01:43] D'Lisa: doing?
[00:01:44] Karen: I'm doing [00:01:45] well. And what about you?
[00:01:47] D'Lisa: Little nervous, but I'm getting over it.
[00:01:50] Karen: What are you nervous about?
[00:01:53] D'Lisa: Being heard Yeah. Actually wanting hear what we have to say.
[00:01:59] Karen: I want you to [00:02:00] feel confident and I want you to feel free to speak your mind and your heart because the whole reason we are doing this podcast is to educate and to help the next generation coming.
[00:02:13] D'Lisa: Yes,
[00:02:14] Karen: So
[00:02:14] why don't we [00:02:15] start off by getting a little background. Tell us about yourself before you became a firefighter.
[00:02:20] D'Lisa:
[00:02:20] There was nothing for us to do or anything. So coming here to California, there were, there was sports, there was mechanics, there was all [00:02:30] kinds of things that we can get into. And I started off. My educational background preparing to become a physical education teacher, and that was okay, but I wanted more.
[00:02:44] I started [00:02:45] leaning more towards coaching, so I changed it to recreation and then eventually to kinesiology because I wanted to know more about the body. I worked for Parks and Rec for 5 years. prop 13 [00:03:00] pretty much killed that program. So I went military and did five years in the military and was fighter.
[00:03:11]
[00:03:11] Karen: So what was it like in the military?
[00:03:14] D'Lisa: It was [00:03:15] mostly pretty cool. The only drawback was my clearance level. I came in as a E four and I had a top secret Nato clearance. My movements were restricted because I had to be available just in case something top secret or above came through.[00:03:30]
[00:03:30] But it was okay because I was able to travel all over Germany and see a lot of different things. It gave me a real eyeopener on how to think strategically, taking in [00:03:45] logistics, things like that. And then it also gave me great discipline that actually helped me. Deal with some of the activities in the fire department
[00:03:57] Karen: Really, can you give us an example of how that [00:04:00] background helped you in the fire department?
[00:04:04] D'Lisa: most of the time after I promoted and I was in charge of units, I read everything like a military op, it was easier for me to put it in that format because I [00:04:15] knew that all the angles that I wanted to Take on the thought processes, the plans the strategy, the tactics, all that was part of my makeup.
[00:04:24] So I felt more comfortable doing it that way. It also helped me with dealing [00:04:30] with some of the quote unquote meet heads on jobs. And I was able to handle that as well. So it. I'm glad it, cause if they'd have caught me before the military discipline, I don't think they would've liked me very well.[00:04:45]
[00:04:45] Karen: It's interesting that the military prepared you for the job as a firefighter, but when did you transition to becoming a firefighter?
[00:04:55] D'Lisa: I had came home from the military and [00:05:00] transitioning from. That type of career to something in the private sector was a little bit off for me. I had started to prepare to go into the F B I, they had been courting me my [00:05:15] last year in the service because of my clearance level.
[00:05:18] And they had promised me I would start out as a GS nine, which was, okay. So Gs.
[00:05:25] Karen: Wow.
[00:05:27] D'Lisa: But the thing about it was during the last [00:05:30] phases of testing my grandmother became ill and she needed someone to take care of her. And family comes first. So I let that FBI thought go, take, took care of my mom, my grandmother rather.
[00:05:44] And then[00:05:45] the opportunity for the fire department came up and that's how I got involved in that.
[00:05:51] Karen: What did it mean to you to become a firefighter with all that under your belt? Facing those same obstacles in the [00:06:00] military you faced, in the paramilitary organization as the fire department.
[00:06:05] D'Lisa: I keep reminding them. They say it's semi military and I have to tell them that it's really a chief imitation of semi military because they really have no concept [00:06:15] of what.
[00:06:15] Discipline, military discipline entails. But for me it was stability because I was a single parent. I needed a job where [00:06:30] I was gonna be able to take care of me and my daughter. The schedule was, The main thing that enticed me, and it was because they said 10 to 12 days a month. I really care what the salary was.
[00:06:43] It was the days, it [00:06:45] was the days of work that I was really concerned about and it actually worked out for me over the years. Really. Did.
[00:06:55] Karen: Would you recommend this job to young women coming on today? Growing up [00:07:00] today?
[00:07:01] D'Lisa: I would mainly because, The fire department still is not reflecting the demographics of the city, and especially in terms of black females. I was on for 31 years and we only [00:07:15] had eight black female firefighters on the job. And now that I'm retired, there's only six and three of them I recruited
[00:07:24] to the department. So I'm confused as why black females. Are not [00:07:30] being brought on the department. It just doesn't make any sense. And I've brought many to the door
[00:07:37] from the military, the building trades, other departments and they just cannot get hired.
[00:07:43] Karen: Do you think there's still that [00:07:45] same old stereotype going around that women are lowering the standards and they can't do the job?
[00:07:53] D'Lisa: they can't use that argument anymore? But as far as you look at the [00:08:00] racial makeup of women on the job right now, and it doesn't include that many minorities, and that's where my issue is. I don't know if me as a black female scared the hell out of them or what, but. [00:08:15] We're strong, we're self-sufficient. We can handle whatever you give us to do. It's just give us a chance. Just give us a chance and we can prove to you that we are viable candidates for the job Lowering the standards. No, [00:08:30] that, that's a weak excuse. They used it. They used it prior. Two women coming on when they were talking about black men coming on the job.
[00:08:40] And that issue is still being used to this day and I don't [00:08:45] understand standards are not being lowered at all.
[00:08:50] Karen: What kind of assignments did you hold in the fire department? What
[00:08:56] were your expertise?
[00:08:59] D'Lisa: My [00:09:00] expertise, As a firefighter I was tasked by the fire chief at the time to do something about recruitment and he wanted more women in, more minorities and all that. And the first thing I ha I do when I come into a [00:09:15] situation is I take a look around and find out what's there, what's working, what's not, and then I come up with a plan.
[00:09:25] And I always make a report. They're usually not used to that, but that's [00:09:30] how the military does. So I always make an analysis and then I present that. And what I found was there was nothing to assist minorities and women to get on the job. So we had to [00:09:45] build a plan and a program, mainly it was the physical abilities, finding a test that was viable for us.
[00:09:52] Developing a mentoring program and helping them prepare for their oral interviews. It's different with minorities and [00:10:00] women because we didn't have family members on the job that can, coach you in and do all that. So we had to start from the bottom up and we built those programs to address those and it was successful enough that [00:10:15] those programs are still there today.
[00:10:17] So it, it was something that was needed. Once I promoted it was basically the same thing. Every unit that I went to, I [00:10:30] analyzed everything. Came up with a game plan and I handled that and being assigned to the bureau, which was confusing because the bureau is where they make the rules.
[00:10:43] For safety for us [00:10:45] in the field and for the constituents, right? But the bureau is not highly looked at and so it to find out that they had antiquated equipment, they were still doing things with paper and pencil. Technology [00:11:00] sucked really bad. And so it was like, okay, we had to start from the ground up.
[00:11:03] Training and technology was the main thing that we had to work on. And that's where I started. And once we started getting that, In place. We were able to [00:11:15] do a lot of good things in the legal unit. We just by increasing our technology, we were able to reach out to other departments, other agencies and work with them because we were on the same wavelength [00:11:30] technology-wise.
[00:11:31] And also just being able to work with them as A small task force to get things done. We increased our revenue there from $3,000 a year to in the three years that I was in [00:11:45] legal to 3.9 million. So it was something that just needed to be revamped, and that's where I came in and helped out with that.
[00:11:54] When I was assigned to the environmental unit, it was basically the same [00:12:00] thing where you start off with, Analyzing everything. You finding out technology is part of the problem. Training is part of the problem. So you go in increments, you get everybody trained up. You get them their technology. We were the first unit to [00:12:15] have mobile inspectors where they could do whatever they needed to do, write notices, print them out, get them signed everything in the field, and then upload the information later. It wasn't paper and pencil anymore. We actually got all of our files [00:12:30] digitized. We made things the ability to access things a lot easier. And we increased the revenue there from 4 million to 10 just by updating the system and being able to reach out. So[00:12:45] it was I felt good because It increased the the self-esteem of the units.
[00:12:52] You, you they actually walked around proud because we were actually doing positive things. That's how I looked at it, and we were a team.[00:13:00]
[00:13:00] Karen: I beg to differ. I, your humility is to be applauded. But I was there when some of the things that you were talking about were being implemented, and if you didn't have the foresight to at least analyze it with the tools that you brought from the [00:13:15] military, none of those things would've gotten done.
[00:13:17] They would've just been going through the motions like they always have. I'm proud of you being in those positions and bringing, the department up to par. But I wanna know more about you, Delisa, as a person. What was the most [00:13:30] challenging thing for you on the fire department? Personally, I.
[00:13:34] D'Lisa: The main thing was just being heard. It was, I don't know what it was. It, if I had input, they didn't wanna hear it. If I had [00:13:45] information, they didn't wanna see it. And so it was like I had to find different ways to communicate. And I had mentioned it before, but I would just put a mustache on it because they didn't wanna hear or see me.
[00:13:58] So I would have [00:14:00] a male put in that position and they had no problems with. Getting our plan or our strategy and putting that in place. I'll tell you how bad it was. I never got a shield and I never got a helmet as a
[00:14:13] captain.
[00:14:14] Karen: [00:14:15] Wow.
[00:14:16] F 80 for it. And they just denied it. They just weren't gonna do it. That's how it was. But I was fine because as long as I had my team together and they understood what we were there [00:14:30] to do. Then me, my team, they would go to their different positions and I'd just be over there leaning up against the car with my l a FD baseball cap on. I didn't care that me got information back and came back one hell a [00:14:45] report, and I didn't have to ask anybody Because unlike, unlike the men, your ego wasn't all tied up in the job.
[00:14:52] D'Lisa: up.
[00:14:52] Nope. Still gonna get it done. And like I keep telling them. I kept reminding them, I'm military, so you give me an [00:15:00] assignment that was gonna be completed. No matter
[00:15:02] Karen: making it.
[00:15:04] D'Lisa: No matter what.
[00:15:07] Karen: would you do it all over again?
[00:15:10] Would you become a firefighter all over again?
[00:15:13] D'Lisa: I would, I think [00:15:15] I would try to. Huh? I would come in a little younger. But I think that coming in when I did, I was, it was time for me to be introduced to the fire department and put my fingerprint on it because[00:15:30] I believe in karma and I think that the f b I was going to be a good choice for me, but my direction was, my karma was the fire department.
[00:15:40] And I think that. The fire department is in a better [00:15:45] place because some of the things that we instituted and we provided as guidance on how to do things the right way or not the right way, or an efficient and effective way.
[00:15:58] Karen: Getting back to when you came on, were [00:16:00] you welcome during the department?
[00:16:03] D'Lisa: Oh no, that was funny.
[00:16:04] It when I got there, they were wearing these t-shirts that had a silhouette of a female on there with a cross, it was crossed out. And so I tried to get one and [00:16:15] they were looking at me like,
[00:16:17] Karen: like no women.
[00:16:19] D'Lisa: Yeah. And so I was like where can I get one? That's pretty cool, because you don't want women, and here I am.
[00:16:25] So I, it was just a small space I thought, but no, they weren't having [00:16:30] it. But what I found out was that the older firefighters were more receptive of women coming on than the younger group. The younger men thought that we were in competition, and it was like, no, dude, I got a family fee just like you,
[00:16:44] and [00:16:45] I'm here. Okay. But they and there were some that voiced their distaste of women on the job and I just politely told 'em they'll get over it cause they ain't going nowhere.
[00:16:58] Karen: you ever have any altercations with [00:17:00] the men that you worked with?
[00:17:03] D'Lisa: yeah, there was a couple. They caught that army survival training
[00:17:09] Really? Can you tell us a story?I was, it was during probation [00:17:15] and there was this one firefighter, I found out that he likes hitting women, and that day he was working at my station and we were doing hose change and I, had [00:17:30] jumped up in, up in the hose bed to help him. And he told me to get the hell away from him.
[00:17:34] Mean, he socked me in the chest and I. Almost fell out of the, off the rig. But my foot got the hose and so I was just dangling. When I [00:17:45] regained my composure. I went in the office and I told them I took my badge off and I told the captain that there is no in hell that I was gonna take no excuse the expression bullshit off of anybody and he could have my [00:18:00] badge right then.
[00:18:00] And he said, time out. He asked me, don't you have a kid? And I was like, yes sir. He says, don't you need this job? And I said, yes, sir. He said, go out there and handle your business. I was like, thank you, sir. He gave me my badge. I went [00:18:15] out there and I snatched that son of a bitch in the collar and I whooped his ass from the doors to the parking gate and then back.
[00:18:24] And then next thing you know, his company came and his and my captain came out and told him he can't [00:18:30] work there no more. Not while I was on duty and they called me Rocky for a while and then that night, but it was like no, you touch me. We go to getto room.
[00:18:41] Karen: I think you handled that very well. [00:18:45] very well.
[00:18:45] D'Lisa: to touch it.
[00:18:46] Brought back memories and that was my thought process. But I do apologize for the vulgar language.
[00:18:53] Karen: It's okay. I sometimes you gotta meet people on their own terms and I think he needed to know that every woman ain't gonna take a licking and keep [00:19:00] on walking away.
[00:19:01] D'Lisa: Oh no. And it was funny because they found out I rang doorbells cuz I, if I'm not mistaken, I came to your station and rang the doorbell Cause
[00:19:10] Karen: Yes you did cuz someone was harassing me. You're
[00:19:13] D'Lisa: Yeah. Rang you. And I [00:19:15] wanted to let him know, it's no, you know what? Touch me because I do hit back and there was another female, I had rang his, their doorbell and had to let them know who I was.
[00:19:24] I wasn't, no, that behavior was not gonna be tolerated, not by me. [00:19:30] That was one of the rules my dad used to tell us all the time. If you see something wrong, you don't say anything. You're part of the problem. He expected us to do something about it and I was trying to be faithful to my dad. I was gonna do something.
[00:19:42] Karen: You did. You did. You made a difference in my. [00:19:45] Coming on you made it easier for me. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Delisa is there anything else you wanna talk about as far as the job goes, as far as kids coming up [00:20:00] today, what they need to do to prepare themselves for this career?
[00:20:03] D'Lisa: today? I'm still out there trying to mentor and assist with guiding candidates, but we all come in with different talents and don't think [00:20:15] that just because you don't have fire training. That you're not gonna be good. You have other talents that will enhance the qualities of the department.
[00:20:25] And you can't just think it's, it has to be [00:20:30] fire related. Cause it, it doesn't have to be, it's your thought process. It's how your, you think it's your empathy towards your constituents.
[00:20:39] Karen: there's a place for everybody.
[00:20:41] D'Lisa: Yeah it's a place for everybody. The fire department doesn't pay you. It's the [00:20:45] constituents.
[00:20:45] That pay us and we forget that we're there for them. That was the one thing that I was so proud of, was that when we came to LA it was welcoming to us as a family of eight kids and two [00:21:00] adults, and it provided us with a lot of opportunities, but it also gave me a chance to represent the Davies family. As a member of the fire department, cuz I have family all over [00:21:15] Los Angeles and they were proud of me.
[00:21:18] Where we, the first station that I went to, it used to be an abandoned gas station, and that's where we used to park our station wagon and then we would walk down to church. My aunt [00:21:30] lived two blocks away and her son's two blocks from her. So I grew up in the area and. When I was stationed at 46 is when a lot of the neighborhoods, especially the ones from church, when they found out I was on the fire [00:21:45] department, they were so excited for me and they were starting to call, Hey, double D what's going on?
[00:21:51] I called this one in and I was like, thanks, that kind of thing. They were very supportive of
[00:21:58] What
[00:21:59] Karen: church did? What [00:22:00] church was this? Around? What area?
[00:22:02] D'Lisa: it was on. Believe it or not, Vernon and Hoover, it was called the Upper Room Church of God, and it's no longer there as well as the gas station because 46 is took over that whole little area right there.
[00:22:14] Karen: Oh, okay.[00:22:15]
[00:22:16] D'Lisa: But oh yeah, I remember
[00:22:17] those
[00:22:18] Karen: So where the fire station is now.
[00:22:20] D'Lisa: Yeah, where the fire station is now. That's where we used to park.
[00:22:25] Karen: So your family grew up all over LA. How come you didn't stay in LA?[00:22:30]
[00:22:31] D'Lisa: Once I had my daughter, I had to go where I could afford a mortgage and a sitter, and a, I couldn't do it in la so I had to move where I could [00:22:45] afford, and I just had to make allowances.
[00:22:48] When my daughter started going to school, she basically lived with the sitter, and I would come and visit her. On my days off, I would stay and help the sitter. Until she got outta school, [00:23:00] then we would do homework and then, get her ready for bed and then I would go home. But some of the other days I would do fire prevention for the station.
[00:23:10] I would do something because I wanted to be a mom [00:23:15] on her time and she got her time. I was not gonna take that away from her because the schedule took enough time away, but, When she became older, then I was more visible in her life. When she was outta school, I [00:23:30] was outta work, I was, I betrayed vacations.
[00:23:33] I would do whatever I needed to do to give her quality time.
[00:23:38] Karen: Okay. Delisa. I think they're just about, Wraps up our time right now. I just want to thank you for the interview and thank [00:23:45] you for, letting us know that it's not easy being a firefighter and sometimes you might have to, even whoop some ass, but or beat somebody up. But we thank you for your expertise and for making the fire department a better place.
[00:23:58] D'Lisa: place.
[00:23:58] I'm trying.
[00:23:59] Karen: All [00:24:00] right. In closing, is there anything you wanna add?
[00:24:03] D'Lisa: Oh no. I just hope that everyone enjoys the podcast and we hope to introduce you to other pioneer women in the fire service in the future.
[00:24:14] Karen: Thank you. I look [00:24:15] forward to it all. All right. Bye. Everyone from the African-American Firefighters Museum, this is Karen Slider and Delisa Davies, the First African American female firefighter, to complete probation for LA [00:24:30] City Fire Department.
[00:24:31] Thank you, Delisa.
[00:24:34] D'Lisa: thank you.
[00:24:35] Karen: Bye-bye. I hope you've been inspired by our conversation with Delisa. In the [00:24:45] next episode, she will turn the tables and interview me. Karen Slider, the second African-American female firefighter with the City of Los Angeles Fire Department.
[00:24:57] [00:25:00] Remember to visit the African-American Firefighter Museum at 1401 Central Avenue in Los Angeles, situated at the corner of 14th and Central, just across the street from the Coca-Cola [00:25:15] bottling plant. The museum warmly welcomes visitors every Sunday from one to 4:00 PM. For more information, you can reach us at 2 1 3.
[00:25:27] 7 4 4 1 [00:25:30] 7 3 0. Thank you for tuning in and being a part of our journey, celebrating African American women in Fire service. Stay tuned for more remarkable stories and experiences.